Needless to say, I am very pleased to have the chance to interview the "father" of American wargaming, Jack Scruby. Many of us began wargaming with his figures and learned much of what we know about the hobby through his many publication.
MWAN: Can you give us some background on yourself?
JACK: I began making my own military miniatures back in 1952, and at that time was a distributor for Signal Oil Co. out of Los Angeles. Prior to that I had operated a mine and mill for an LA company, and later my father and I had been partners in his cattle ranch. In 1959 I bought a print shop in Visalia, California, and began publishing War Game Digest, the first magazine out about war games.
MWAN: What are you doing now?
JACK: I am operating the Soldier Factory in Cambria, California where we make and sell Toy Soldiers, and other pewter figurines to a broad market all over the USA. Last year I sold my war game business to a young protege, Chris Munro, who is successfully running this operation.
MWAN: Do you still game, if so, what does the Monster of Mittleland game nowadays?
JACK: I retired from wargaming actively about five years ago following open heart surgery. I had to make some changes in my life style and substituted tennis for wargaming.
MWAN: Do you still follow the wargaming scene, if so, what do you think of it?
JACK: I still subscribe to THE COURIER and follow the news about wargaming from it. Publications are good for the hobby in some ways, but I find a lot of little petty arguments going on in them that seem to me to be less than important.
MWAN: How did you become aware of the hobby of wargaming?
JACK: Back in 1952 I met Pat Gorman and Frank Conley (in Visalia). Pat had been playing HG Wells war games, and I became a real addict at that time, and we had many memorable games using the Wells rules and 54mm soldiers. In 1954 I think it was, we held a "convention" in Visalia and had some 14 people attend, and this spread the word around about wargaming in California.
MWAN: You have published many wargaming publications, all of which had a major effect upon the hobby. Which was your favorite?
JACK: My first publication, War Game Digest, was my favorite.
MWAN: How come you never published a book on wargaming?
JACK: I never felt qualified to write a book on wargaming. I always felt gaming was a "moving" hobby, and that unless you wrote a book which could be added to every year or so, the rules, etc., would have been soon outdated. Thus, I saw publishing a magazine as more important.
MWAN: Why do you think wargaming has become more popular in England than in the U.S.A.?
JACK: Because of travel distances.
MWAN: I am aware that you "informally" published rules sets, but why did you never publish them formally?
JACK: I published one set of Napoleonic rules "Fire and Charge", which I printed myself. No one ever asked me to write rules to be published.
MWAN: Why are most wargaming books published in England?
JACK: Probably because there is more of a market, and also maybe because publishers in England are more interested in hobby type books.
MWAN: Wargamers never seem to have supported their wargaming publications very well, at least not well enough to support more than one at a time. Do you agree with this, if so, why do you think it has been the case?
JACK: I totally agree. Wargamers do not seem to spend money on publications. I think the main reason is that they are pretty independent people and don't really care for an editor, or a few prolific writers, to tell them how to play war games. I think most people have their own personal set of rules they have worked out, and really are not at all interested in reading about others.
MWAN: Do you ever hear from the "old-timers"? Are they still involved?
JACK: Most old timers I still correspond with do not play war games nowadays. I suspect they have found other interests. Wargaming is not exactly a family type endeavor, and if your wife is not interest in it, it gets tougher and tougher to find the "time" to play!
MWAN: What period of your wargaming involvement did you enjoy the most?
JACK: Obviously the early years were the most exciting as we were constantly working out new ideas, etc.
MWAN: A friend of mine recently lent me a number of old MINIATURE PARADES and WAR GAME DIGESTS and I have a collection of TABLE TOP TALK, etc. Many articles are still appropriate for publication today. Would there be any possibility of MWAN reprinting some?
JACK: You are welcome to reprint any articles from my old publications that you want. I agree with you that many are still valid today.
MWAN: WARGAMES DIGEST split up in about 1960 or so and WARGAMER'S NEWSLETTER was born. Would you care to comment on how this came about?
JACK: Mostly an ego trip by Don Featherstone and myself, which later we mended and become good friends. As a matter of fact this breakup did a lot for the hobby in that Don's magazine kept going, and I had already decided to fold the WAR GAME DIGEST up as too much work. Afterall I did everything on that publication (as well as all the others) in that I wrote most the stories, did all the typing and printed the darn thing too!
MWAN: Aside from yourself, who do you think had a lot of influence on the hobby?
JACK: I would say Don Featherstone in the early days, and probably Gary Gygax in the "fantasy" days. Also Chas. Roberts who devised the first board games, which gave a tremendous impetus to wargaming.
MWAN: When you first started, did you think wargaming would progress to the level/extent it is today?
JACK: Yes and no. Frankly, I now think that gaming with military miniatures has hit its peak. That is as us oldsters quit playing, some young guy takes it up. But it is a kind of one for one thing, since gaming is only a fraction of the hobby, and not too many people want to spend their time painting soldiers and organizing armies to play with.
MWAN: Do you have any thoughts as to differences in wargamers from the 50's to the 60's to the 70's to the 80's?
JACK: I can spot a real miniatures wargamer the minute he walks into the door of my shop. I would say they all come out of the same mold.
MWAN: Do you think the hobby could have grown more over the years had conditions been different? If so, what are those conditions in your opinion?
JACK: It was bound to happen that once people felt they could make money in their hobby by producing games, figures, etc., that the hobby would start growing by leaps and bounds. Every company that produced something for the hobby, and then went out of business, contributed to the growth of the hobby, even if they didn't make it financially.
MWAN: What did you think of the fantasy craze we saw in the 70's/80's? What effect do you think it had/has upon historical miniatures gaming?
JACK: This, of course, includes the fantasy craze. Only a few still survive that phase nowadays, and I feel they really did more good for the historical side of the hobby than otherwise. If only one out of 100 of those kids who played D&D kept up the hobby and got into historical gaming, then it was worthwhile.
MWAN: Please discuss your sculpting. How did you start, were you trained professionally, etc?
JACK: I had no professional art training, but learned to sculpt on my own. I worked entirely with soldering iron and metal - not wax as most designers do. I still work the same today as I did in the beginning, with of course some new techniques that I have learned over the years.
MWAN: You developed many scales of figures, 54, 40, 30, 25, 20, 9mm. Was there one scale you enjoyed more than others?
JACK: My favorite scale is 30mm, although I love making figures in all scales except N-gauge which was not a labor of love for me but I felt at the time this was the "coming" scale, and so I put a lot of effort into it. I will admit I enjoy gaming in N-gauge more that any other, since you can have huge armies. A game of many thousand N-gauge soldiers on a 20 foot table is absolutely tops in my estimation.
MWAN: What do you think of the quality of figures available today?
JACK: Most are pretty bad, except for one or two. I hate it when war game soldiers have a bigger head than a body!
MWAN: What do you enjoy most about wargaming?
JACK: Facing a good opponent on an eyeball to eyeball level and trying to outsmart him in a fight to the finish.
MWAN: Was there anything you did not like about wargaming?
JACK: No, I loved it all.
MWAN: Seems as though you always leaned toward simplistic rules frameworks in wargames. Any thoughts on this?
JACK: My theory was: lots of action - simple and few rules. I was more interested in making the game exciting than loading it down with so many rules that it leads to arguments rather than action.
MWAN: In your opinion, are there any personality types who are attracted to wargaming?
JACK: Most wargamers are mentally a lot above average I believe. They also seem to be on the "unusual" side. I've liked most people I've met in the hobby, but like anything else, there are also some pills!
MWAN: Where do you see wargaming in five/ten years from now?
JACK: I foresee a constant swing towards wargaming historical games with miniatures and the people who get into this phase of gaming will stay at it. Like myself, they might give up the actual table top action, but they will never give up their military miniatures. The other type of war gamer - who games without miniatures - will continue to grow I'm sure, and they will always out number the man with tin soldiers who loves to fight with soldiers, and not pieces of cardboard.
MWAN: Looking back over the years since you started in the hobby, is there anything you would like to have done differently as regards the hobby and your effect on it?
JACK: This is a pretty broad question, and puts me into an editorial feeling, rather than looking back over 30 years of playing with soldiers and attempt to say how it might be different. I was really sorry to see the great change in wargaming when merchandising games and miniatures became more important that the game itself. My magazines always tried to keep the hobby clean of advertisements and grandiose opinions of individuals who seemed to have all the answers. Mostly I remember the old days when you did a friend a favor by selling him soldiers to play with, rather than trying to make big bucks out of it. In all the years I produced war game soldiers on a professional basis, there were only about two years that I made a living from it. I always had another business going, and did not depend on the soldier business to make a living. This of course is a strictly amateur way of doing things, but it worked for me and I never regretted doing it "my way". The young fellow, Chris Munro, who I sold my wargame business to seems to have this same feeling. Naturally he wants to make a profit, but more important to him (and to me in my time) is getting the best merchandise out to a customer that it is possible to do, and to get it to him at a fair price and on time. It makes me feel good to know that Chris shares my feelings and will carry on my business in the manner that I did. Otherwise, frankly, I would never have sold it, but would have just let it die on the vine, feeling it had it's day in the sunshine, did a lot of good, made a lot of people happy, and let me have one helluva good time while I was active in the hobby.
I would like to thank Jack for taking the time to respond to the interview questions. We owe him a great deal for where we are today in the hobby. I also thank him for his willingness to let MWAN reprint selected articles from his past wargaming publications. I hope that you enjoy them as much as I have. Thank you, Jack.
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© Copyright 1985 Hal Thinglum
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